HIGHLA-L Digest - 24 Sep 2002 to 25 Sep 2002 (#2002-156)
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Wed, 25 Sep 2002 22:00:00 -0400
There are 10 messages totalling 387 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Well & truly a slash thing now (6)
2. Well & truly a slash thing now but hopefully not for much longer
3. (OT:) Re: Well & truly a slash thing now but hopefully not for much longer
(3)
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Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 20:38:21 -1000
From: MacWestie <mac.westie@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now
Marina--
> Then again,
> I find it hard to read slash about Richie. Which makes me think (I
> do not intend this in a disparaging way) that there is a connection
> between how one feels about a character personally and whether one
> feels they might do something "like that".
That would explain why slashing DM grates on my last nerve, but I also find
slashing Methos or Richie to be absurd & irksome--& I am otherwise
ambivalent about those 2 characters.
As for you & RR and me & DM, I think it's natural to feel extra protective
toward one's favorite fictional character, to like him just the way he is
_officially_, & to object strongly to any major change in how he is
presented--especially a change made at the whim of an unauthorized amateur
writer. I might have liked HL:TS just fine had DM been officially created
as a gay or bisexual character, but anyone who thinks that wouldn't have
resulted in an entirely different show is naive.
> >>I think I'd be flattered.
> >Then you are a saint.
>
> You saw it here first, folks. :)
Well, I DID provide some alternatives to sainthood. But, OK, it would be
fine w/ you if others took over your intellectual property & made it their
own. But, can you see that others, especially people who make a living w/
it, like DPP (& I certainly am not in the habit of _protecting_ those
drannits) do, might well be unhappy about it? After all, Highlander is
THEIR corpse & if _anyone_ can just walk up & start gnawing on it....
One of my very favorite things in this arena happens every now & then. Some
fanfic writer will find, to her shock & horror, that _another_ fan
has--believe it or not!--had the low-down gall to STEAL her work, either by
writing about the "original" characters or by making minor changes to a
given story & then presenting it all as HER own creation! The moral outrage
of the original thief/now victim is precious.
Nina
mac.westie@verizon.net
Save Farscape http://farscape.wdsection.com/index.php
Frell Sci Fi, just on principle.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 20:40:55 -1000
From: MacWestie <mac.westie@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now
Wendy gave me a thought by writing--
> I still see two buddies goofing around. But then I am still naive ::cough
cough:::: enough to believe that two men *can*
> goof around with each other and not have any homoerotic urges.
Marina & other slash afficianados, could you please answer me this? When
you are in the real world & see a couple hetero guy pals goofing around, do
you ever have slash flashes similar to those you get while watching HL:TS?
Like--2 buddies are working on the car, & one asks the other to pass him a
wrench--do you ever hear something suggestive there? If not--what's
different about real people vs. fictional characters, in that context? And,
if so--do you think you are seeing subtext that's really there (the guys DO
want each other sexually on some, even if unadmitted, level), or is it ONLY
in your head? I'd really be interested in your thoughts on this.
Wendy again--
> I suppose I simply don't have any "need" (psychologically, creatively,
etc) to imagine that a proportion of the male TV
> Character universe is buggering any other proportion of the male TV
character universe when the cameras stop rolling.
Plus, we KNOW they'd film it & run it during sweeps.
ZK--
>>>I think that part of the reason for Duncan/anyone slash is that it
puts Duncan in the role of a - um - Immortal PoRA(tm) :::: giggling
>>> Putting him - um -on the bottom of a slash relationship is putting him
in a place
where he is inexperienced, ignoranat, and can be seen as weak and
pliable. >>>
I buy that for the slash stories that have big bad Methos leading DM (all
panicky/drooling/but still in denial) by the, um, nose. And, part of what
is just wrong about those stories is that DM NEVER acted like a such dork in
HL:TS. But, then there are all the slash stories that have a suave DM w/
THAT glint in his eye seducing a surprised but pleased Methos or even a
shocked but intrigued RR (which is wrong on SO many levels).
Nina
mac.westie@verizon.net
Save Farscape http://farscape.wdsection.com/index.php
Frell Sci Fi, just on principle.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 20:56:22 -1000
From: MacWestie <mac.westie@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now
Jette--
> <shakes head> She's only one of the biggest names
> in SF these days. You'd have to be living in a cave to
> miss her
So? I'll have you know that in some parts of the world in some time
periods, EVERYONE who was anyone lived in caves. And there was NO moral
stigma attached to it! Besides, my cave has a gorgeous ocean view.
Wendy--
> Well...I guess I live in a cave. Never heard of her.
Just to be clear--Wendy & I don't live in the SAME cave.
Jette & Wendy:
>Can I join you on that bench, Wendy? :-)
>>Sure. If you don't mind living in a cave. <EG>
OK--too much slash discussion--that's sounding a bit Canadian to me.
<Jette runs screaming into the night>
Wendy--try some Bat-Be-Gone before entertaining.
>>(Actually, the whole concept of LOTR slash makes me more than a bit
>>crazy.)(You just *can't* take my favorite book since I was about 11 and
>>do*that* to my favorite characters!)
LotR references are lost on me. Tolkien always left me cold, as did most
fantasy (HL excepted), as opposed to sci fi. But, here in my cave, I've
gotten out of the habit of reading even sci fi lately. (Actually, HL isn't
really fantasy; whenever they tried exploring that side of things, it got
ugly--Zeist, Holy Hot Tub, Cassie.)
Nina (who was reading _Atlas Shrugged_ while pals pored over _LotR_; slash
John Galt with Hank Reardon or Francisco d'Anconia & I WILL make you suffer)
mac.westie@verizon.net
Save Farscape http://farscape.wdsection.com/index.php
Frell Sci Fi, just on principle.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 09:55:38 -0400
From: comet <hickss@pegasus.cc.ucf.edu>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now
On Tue, 24 Sep 2002, Ace!Miracle wrote:
> That, and I honestly think some slashers will slash anyone. I personally
> don't mind slash, although most pairings make me say "Uh, no." (comet and
> I had "fun" at lunch one day thinking of the squickiest pairs we could.
> Then we shared our pain with Liser.)
And all I still have to say is, "my eyes, my eyes!!!"
comet
hickss@pegasus.cc.ucf.edu
I merely chewed in self defense. I never swallowed. -- Draco, Dragonheart
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 16:43:29 +0200
From: Marina Bailey <tmar@sifl.iid.co.za>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now
Nina asks:
>Marina & other slash afficianados, could you please answer me this? When
>you are in the real world & see a couple hetero guy pals goofing around, do
>you ever have slash flashes similar to those you get while watching HL:TS?
>Like--2 buddies are working on the car, & one asks the other to pass him a
>wrench--do you ever hear something suggestive there?
Well... sometimes. I've even made remarks to the kids I teach when
they are hanging onto each other or something. "Do you really want
to be holding his hand? People might get the wrong idea." They
usually let go pretty fast (accomplishing my goal - to get them
to let go and stand in the line or sit properly at the desk), but one
or two have joked about it and not cared. (Then I will have to say,
"Well, fine, but could you stand by yourselves now? We're waiting to
go in the class.")
>do you think you are seeing subtext that's really there (the guys DO
>want each other sexually on some, even if unadmitted, level), or is it ONLY
>in your head? I'd really be interested in your thoughts on this.
I think it's in my head, which is fine. :)
- Marina.
\\ "You've heard it said that living well is ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
// the best revenge? Au contraire - living || R I C H I E >> \\
\\ forever is the best revenge." - Lacroix ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
//=====Marina Bailey====tmar@sifl.iid.co.za====|| \\
\\=============Chief Flag Waver and Defender of Richie============//
"There is a Daniel Jackson-shaped hole in that show." - My brother,
about the sixth season of Stargate SG-1.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 18:16:41 +0100
From: beccaelizabeth <r.day@netcom.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now
MacWestie wrote:
> Marina & other slash afficianados,
>could you please answer me this? When
> you are in the real world & see a couple
> hetero guy pals goofing around, do
> you ever have slash flashes similar to
> those you get while watching HL:TS?
no. life is confusing enough without extra layers of motive. RL things
mean what they say. says the girl who always think guys ask what your
reading because they actually want to know.
> If not--what's
> different about real people vs. fictional
> characters, in that context?
Characters are made up. Imaginary. You can therefore imagine whatever
you like about them and have it be just as real as the characters were
in the first place (if not necessarily as plausible, consistent,
interesting to others etc)
making up stuff about real people is lying. and often hurtful. so you
dont.
also generally speaking it none of your business with RL people. TV
characters are everyones business.
beccaelizabeth
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Delphi/4212
The Secret of a Balanced Life is Reverence and Mirth in
Equal Proportion
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 17:21:28 -0700
From: Pat Lawson <plawson@webleyweb.com>
Subject: Re: Well & truly a slash thing now but hopefully not for much longer
Liser wrote:
>One of the most famous "evidence of slashy subtext" scenes in HL is
>the nose-painting in Chivalry. People who are inclined toward slash
>interpret it as couched in sexuality. People who are
>not...well...don't. So, perhaps that quality that I mentioned above
>is really more of a mind-set?
Really? I'm not a fan of slash and my first reaction to that scene was
that they were flirting. It looked sexual to me. Does that mean I'm
"inclined toward slash"?
Or maybe I'm just a dirty ol' lady who takes notice of sexual overtones of
every flavor. Doesn't matter to me if they're Canadian, Hawaiian, or
Scottish.
>I'd be curious to know whether or not someone like me--a non-slash
>fan--has ever watched a show and decided independent of outside
>(fandom) influence that any two given characters must be homosexually
>interested in one another, despite the fact that it's never displayed
>as such on the show.
See above. I know there have been other cases, but CRAFT strikes again.
Pat (who thought Hank Reardon & Francisco d'Anconia made a lovely
couple)
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 20:41:25 -0400
From: Morgan <morrigan13@earthlink.net>
Subject: (OT:) Re: Well & truly a slash thing now but hopefully not for much
longer
At 05:21 PM 09/25/2002 -0700, you wrote:
> Pat (who thought Hank Reardon & Francisco d'Anconia made a lovely
>couple)
Tee hee!! Extra points for those who can name the author and title (yes,
it's a book).
Tho' I kept hoping for a threesome....
Morgan
List Witch Emerita, Highla-L
morrigan13@earthlink.net
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Get a taste for religion--lick a Witch.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 21:00:47 -0400
From: Caroline Dechert <enilorac@voicenet.com>
Subject: Re: (OT:) Re: Well & truly a slash thing now but hopefully not for
much longer
At 08:41 PM 9/25/02 -0400, you wrote:
>At 05:21 PM 09/25/2002 -0700, you wrote:
>
> > Pat (who thought Hank Reardon & Francisco d'Anconia made a lovely
> >couple)
>
>Tee hee!! Extra points for those who can name the author and title (yes,
>it's a book).
>
>Tho' I kept hoping for a threesome....
>
>Morgan
Atlas Shrugged. Ayn Rand.
Caroline (making a quick return to the list, via the long-lost pirate
ship)
"When the bird and the book disagree, always believe the bird."
... James Audubon
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 21:45:33 -0400
From: Caroline Dechert <enilorac@voicenet.com>
Subject: Re: (OT:) Re: Well & truly a slash thing now but hopefully not for
much longer
> > Pat (who thought Hank Reardon & Francisco d'Anconia made a lovely
> >couple)
>
>Tee hee!! Extra points for those who can name the author and title (yes,
>it's a book).
>
>Tho' I kept hoping for a threesome....
>
>Morgan
With Dagny or John?
Caroline
enilorac@voicenet.com
"When the bird and the book disagree, always believe the bird."
... James Audubon
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End of HIGHLA-L Digest - 24 Sep 2002 to 25 Sep 2002 (#2002-156)
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